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Jneale
February 2, 2005, 05:48 PM
John Searle and the Chinese Room: A Defence of Turing and Behaviourism
We are entering or indeed are already upon one of the most exciting periods of epistemic history. Epistemology concerns issues that were always considered to be suited to the realm of philosophy, essentially that the concepts it discussed were too abstract in their nature to be considered science. Today these issues are no longer involved in purely philosophical debate but in cognitive science and its derivatives also.
I shall refer to the mind as if I was advocating substance dualism, normally associated as part of Descartes meditations; however I don’t wish to enter into a debate over monism, dualism, as it really has no effect on the issues I want to deal with. Every psychological attribute has now, due to considerable recent advances in neuro-anatomical science, been associated with a specific location in the brain. The ability to assimilate visual input with the occipital lobe, the process of sorting objects into categories with the temporal lobe, Intentionality with the parietal lobe and reasoning with the frontal lobe. Even semantics have been associated with activity in parts of the brain.
Semantics is a frequently used term in cognitive science and it is important for me to clarify what I intend by the term. Language has two levels, syntax and semantics. Syntax is the sound, series of letters the symbol I use to represent the semantics behind language. When I read this essay you hear the symbols, syntax, and interpret its semantic meaning, when you ask questions at the end you will do so through syntax and I shall be interpreting with semantics. Despite this relationship being made slightly more complex by the presence of an internal monologue the concept remains the same.
One of the most interesting parts of cognitive and computational sciences is the artificial intelligence or A.I. It forms a large part of discussion in modern epistemology but also in ethics and computer programming.
Where do these ideas of Artificial intelligence originate from? It was in fact a British mathematician who first discussed the possibilities of computer science who also suggested A.I., his name was Alan Turning and he published his first paper in 1936 even before the creation of ASCII binary or any of today’s governing rules of computing. This single work given the rather un-catchy title, ‘On computable numbers, with an application to the entscheidungsproblem’ was a founding part of computer science and made possible the advent of computers as we know them today. Although the implications of this paper are very exciting to read it is inordinately complex and tedious, so I have paraphrased and slightly embellished this extract. It is important to note here that when he mentions a computer he means a human who undertakes a computation.

‘The behaviour of a computer is determined by the symbols which he is observing and his ‘state of mind’ at that moment. We may suppose that there is a bound to the number of symbols which the computer can observe at one moment. If he wishes to observe more he must use successive observations.’ If we are to imagine the operations performed by computer to be split up into the most simple base operations imaginable and each of these is denoted by a symbol on a tape ‘if we know the state of the system of we would also know the sequence of symbols on the tape’

Turing then goes on to suppose we made a machine that did exactly this then we could create a computing machine. This is the basis of today’s stored program computers. Indeed anything that ‘computes’ in the manner described above counts as a Turing machine. The Turing machine hypothesis was then used to solve a problem surrounding a concept known as mechanical method this is a mathematical notion of a class of problems and results (functions) that can be solved or attained by following fixed rules.
Around the same time Alonzo Church, an American logician, working independently from Turing solved the same problem through a concept of ‘lambda-definability’, which unfortunately being of beyond degree standard mathematics I cannot explain to you. However essentially he then again linked this to recursive functions, incidentally this is the basis for a technique used by modern day computer programming.
In an appendix of a later paper Turing then shows both of these solutions to be essentially the same. Resulting in the Church-Turing THESIS which says that every function whose values can be attained mechanically, by a fixed method are computable by a Turing Machine.
This thesis which is currently thought of as a conjecture as opposed to a definition is the starting point for the entire conception of Artificial Intelligence. If it is true electronic computers MUST be able to possess at least human level intelligence. This is because cognitive science tells us that any cognitive process no matter how complex is eventually split into primitive computations or routines that are mechanical in their nature. Thus anything a brain can do a Turing machine or computer could in theory do at least as effectively.
This thesis was the reason behind large amounts of financial investment in Artificial intelligence. Computer science truly believed that such a target was attainable. Machines slowly surfaced who, it was claimed, could understand stories, and over time they did so with increasing ability.
It would be prudent of me to introduce to you a very important distinction, between two conceptions. Although these had always been present in discussion of AI, it was John Searle who was the first to define them adequately. These distinctions are not approaches to AI but conceptions of its aims.
The first, Strong AI sees AI as an attempt to design and build a machine that displays a range of psychological attributes, things such as reason or intentionality, even consciousness and eventually feeling and emotion. Someone who subscribes to strong AI must also agree to these propositions says Searle:
“a) An appropriately programmed computer really would have, or be, a mind in the same sense that you or I have.�
And,
“b) Its following the programs in question would explain its ability to do the psychological things it does.�
Something that is usually associated with, although not always defined as part of Strong AI, is the belief in the Turing test. This is a test Turing proposed that is essentially borne out of behaviourism, due to Descartes, cogito ergo sum it is only through empirical means that I can suggest, not know you are intelligent. It is merely because you exhibit similar behaviour to me that I conclude you are also intelligent. Turing says that if an invigilator cannot discriminate between the responses of a machine and those of a human then it should be attributed with intelligence.
The opposite of this is logically named Weak A.I. and it says simply that electronic digital computers are powerful instruments, for helping us to model, and thereby understand, the mind.
These distinctions are often used whilst committing a straw man fallacy, the term strong AI has become somewhat derogatory partly due to the effect of Searle’s arguments and also due to the claims made by early subscribers to Strong AI. In 1957 Simon and Newell two advocates of these ideas of Strong AI and founding fathers of AI research, expressed this view.
‘There are now in the world machines that think, that learn and that create. Moreover their ability to do these things is going to rapidly increase until… they can handle a range of problems coextensive to those to which the human mind has been applied. ‘
An example of such a program is one of the story understanding programs I previously described. These machines could take a simple story such as, to use Searle’s example:
‘A man went into a restaurant and ordered a hamburger. When the hamburger arrived it was burned to a crisp, and the man stormed out of the restaurant angrily, without paying for the hamburger or leaving a tip.’

When asked "Did the man eat the hamburger?" the machine would be able to answer, "No, he did not.� It could do this with a range of different although fairly similar stories and a range although again fairly similar questions and answers.
It was exactly the claim that this constituted understanding that Searle originally set out to refute, to do so he created this argument:
1. Programs a purely syntactical (formal)
2. Minds (human ones at least) have semantics, mental contents.
3. Syntax by itself is neither the same as or sufficient for semantic content.
Therefore:
4. Programs by themselves are neither constitutive of nor sufficient for minds.
Although he has rephrased this same argument in countless volumes the basic structure remains the same. The following thought experiment the ‘Chinese Room Argument’ was or at least Searle would have it that this argument was intended to illustrate the truth value of the third premise. Many people see it as a reformulation rather than the underlying argument of the thought experiment however in truth this is unimportant.

‘Suppose that I’m locked in a room and given a large batch of Chinese writing. Suppose furthermore (as is indeed the case) that I know no Chinese, either written or spoken, and that I’m not even confident that I could recognize Chinese writing as Chinese writing distinct from, say, Japanese writing or meaningless squiggles. To me, Chinese writing is just so many meaningless squiggles. Now suppose further that after this first batch of Chinese writing I am given a second batch of Chinese script together with a set of rules for correlating the second batch with the first batch. The rules are in English, and I understand these rules as well as any other native speaker of English. They enable me to correlate one set of formal symbols with another set of formal symbols, and all that "formal" means here is that I can identify the symbols entirely by their shapes. Now suppose also that I am given a third batch of Chinese symbols together with some instructions, again in English, that enable me to correlate elements of this third batch with the first two batches, and these rules instruct me how to give back certain Chinese symbols with certain sorts of shapes in response to certain sorts of shapes given me in the third batch. Unknown to me, the people who are giving me all of these symbols call the first batch a "script," they call the second batch a "story," and they call the third batch "questions." Furthermore, they call the symbols I give them back in response to the third batch "answers to the questions," and the set of rules in English that they gave me, they call the "program." Now just to complicate the story a little, imagine that these people also give me stories in English, which I understand, and they then ask me questions in English about these stories, and I give them back answers in English. Suppose also that after a while I get so good at following the instructions for manipulating the Chinese symbols and the programmers get so good at writing the programs that from the external point of view—that is, from tile point of view of somebody outside the room in which I am locked—my answers to the questions are absolutely indistinguishable from those of native Chinese speakers. Nobody just looking at my answers can tell that I don’t speak a word of Chinese. Let us also suppose that my answers to the English questions are, as they no doubt would be, indistinguishable from those of other native English speakers, for the simple reason that I am a native English speaker. From the external point of view—from the point of view of someone reading my "answers"—the answers to the Chinese questions and the English questions are equally good. But in the Chinese case, unlike the English case, I produce the answers by manipulating uninterpreted formal symbols. As far as the Chinese is concerned, I simply behave like a computer; I perform computational operations on formally specified elements. For the purposes of the Chinese, I am simply an instantiation of the computer program.’
So what has Searle achieved in this experiment? Well he has illustrated a machine that possesses no understanding whatsoever. However it appears it could pass the Turing test as described earlier. In effect it could fake being a Chinese speaker. Secondly that contrary to the belief of Strong A.I. a formal program operating as Turing originally conceived, one that simply manipulates symbols could never constitute a mind. This argument forms the most damning critique of Strong A.I. Calling into question one of its most founding parts the Church-Turing thesis described earlier. Mathematical criticisms of this idea have already been put forward establishing the possibility that there exists within the brain non computable neural processes.
There are many oppositions to this second part of the Chinese Room, a typical argument that although one program as illustrated above does not understand Chinese, a compliment or group of them – an entire system would, essentially he has committed a part whole fallacy. However clearly if this program was able to give out purely syntactic responses without ever engaging in semantics, then any number of further similar programs grouped with the first could take these syntactical responses and further operate them, none of them gleaning any kind of semantic meaning. It would be just a more complex yet equally ineffective program. I must concede that I have not yet seen an effective denial of this second half of the Chinese room argument.
I do however have questions relating to the denial of the Turing test. I feel there is one underlying assumption in Searle’s argument which no one has ever truly exploited. The reason for this is perhaps because if supporters of Strong AI were to use it they would most likely be pointing out fatal flaws in their own thinking. This assumption is that the room in its current form would be able to pass a Turing test. If we were agreed upon the previously mentioned theory of non computable neural processes it would make this even less likely. As a conversation is not a series of unrelated questions answers and statements, but there is a correlation between the end of a conversation and the beginning. To illustrate this further,
Imagine overhearing this conversation between the tester T and the Intelligent Person P:

T: Hi there my name is James I would like to apply for a job.
C: Ok James just go through that blue door and take an application form.
T: Thanks, oh and also is there a toilet near here?
C: Yes its signposted from the same room you get an application form.
T; Ok thanks a lot for your help.
C: No problem. Oh and good luck with the job application.

This conversation flows from one question to the next and each part bears some relevance to earlier parts of the conversation. A program operating like the Chinese Room suggests would not exhibit such qualities although it may hold the conversation it would not assimilate earlier information it would sound more disjointed, perhaps like this.

T: Hi there my name is James id like to apply for a job.
C: Ok through the blue door and take an application form.
T: Thanks, oh and also is there a toilet near here?
C: Yes, through the blue door and its signposted.
T: Ok thanks a lot for your help.
C: No problem.

As you can see although this may hint at understanding it does not flow in the same manner, the computer has no recollection of describing the blue door because it was merely an automatic response manipulating the words to give an appropriate answer. Although this machine would be very good at mimicking intelligent behaviour it would, and this would become increasing clear over the extended test period, be unable to make references to information a human would take from the conversation because it would not understand it. It would not behave adequately to pass the Turing test. In effect it would treat a conversation as a series of statements rather than a conversation.
This is how I always understood a Chinese room program to operate, however, there is another way that such a device could be envisaged, which Ned Block first raised he called this machine a ‘blockhead’. Block said that there is a finite amount of conversations a computer could be involved in. if the test lasted 2 weeks there is an enormous, but not infinite number of possible conversations. If the program could automatically respond not only to each individual statement, but to the conversation as an entire entity it would be able to pass the test perfectly. In a Turing test this machine would appear to be intelligent. Thus despite the near impossibility that a block program could be built I must concede that the Turing test in its current form is not an adequate test. However I suggest it would be very obvious to anyone who looked internally at the machine and saw its program that they would know that it was not an intelligent device but merely droid.
To resolve this issue I would like to return briefly to the idea which arose earlier, that of Descartes, cogito ergo sum, and the simple fact I can never know that any of you are intelligent in the same way I am. I assume you are because the behaviour you exhibit is so similar to mine and when you react to situations you appear to do it in the same way as I do. Suppose for a moment however I had a serious doubt that you were intelligent, I truly believed that you merely appeared to be operating in a similar fashion to myself but you were not thinking at all. You were simply an enormous ‘Blockhead’ program. It would not be a considered a bad idea for me to compare myself to you, on a neurological level. I mentioned earlier how every function of the mind has been attributed to activity in some part of the brain. With an MRI scan I could see that not only did you externally behave in a similar manner to myself, but internally as well.
Such lengths would perhaps be a little bit over the top, it is more likely I would just be placed in some kind of institution, however if computer science was claiming to have created an artificial intelligence I don’t believe examining its behaviour to such an extent would be considered over the top in the least. I would suggest therefore that the Chinese Room argument forms part of a two pronged attack. First it suggests that syntax is not sufficient for semantics, this part of the argument I believe to be sound, and I would not dispute it. I would therefore deny Strong AI under perhaps its original definition, and I would agree that true intelligence could not be borne out of pure syntax, or symbol manipulation. The second attack that the Chinese room argument makes is a refutation of the Turing test. If we were to take the original definition of behaviourism I would also agree with this first part, however I do not feel this is the only way in which we could define such an idea of behaviourism.
All mental phenomena however we choose to refer to them have some impact on the physical world. I wish to suggest that this impact should also be referred to as behaviour. Not simply the obvious behaviours perceivable solely through our senses, but those which we can perceive with the aid of tools, the way in which the program works is just as important and just as much a component of its behaviour as the way it outwardly appears to work. Therefore I would suggest that the Chinese room argument does not completely deny a Turing test and this part of Strong AI if no other remains intact.

PoodleLovinPessimist
February 2, 2005, 10:26 PM
Not a bad post. It's pretty thorough and captures the thrust of the Chinese Room argument as well as its chief rebuttal. I recommend you put a blank line between paragraphs.

The first issue I have with the Chinese Room is that Searle introduces the notion of "semantics", but does not give us a positive definition; it is only the "negative" definition of not what he's doing in the Chinese room in Chinese, but is what he's doing with English.

His conclusion, though, is odd: He explicitly posits a system where "semantics" are not taking place, but that is empirically indistinguishable from a system where "semantics" are indeed taking place. There are two ways of looking at this conclusion. The first is Searle's: That empirical adequacy cannot detect "semantics". The second is to conclude that there is no such thing as semantics; "semantics" is just a name for a sufficiently complicated syntax.

Your observation is accurate that, in order to actually pass a Turing Test, the program must do more functions than Searle suggests: It must store and intelligently retreive a lot of context-dependent state information; as you add more and more functions to the Chinese room, it becomes harder to justify Searle's inference that the Chinese room is "obviously" unlike a mind.

The counterexample of the Blockhead is offered to head off this objection. But consider this: Let us assume there is a Turing Machine that operates in much the same manner as a mind that rebuts the canonical Chinese room. It is then the case that a Blockhead is completely mappable to that ordinary Chinese Turing Machine; they are merely different representations of the same program.

To implement a Blockhead, you must list each possible conversation in the domain of discourse. This is a lot of conversation. Finite, but (without doing the math) it's entirely possible that for even a simple domain, there are more possible conversations than there are atoms in the universe. Secondly, some machine must move through these conversations based on the context. Since each conversation must be enumerated, the number that refers to each conversation can be said to "store" the context-dependent state information. Indeed, it is easy to see that the numbers which index each conversation must have at least as many bits as whatever stores the more direct state information in the Ordinary Chinese Turing Machine. So the Blockhead is doing the exact same thing as the OCTM, storing the same amount of information, doing the same arithmetical computations; indeed it is doing all the functional mind-like things that the OCTM is doing. In other words, even Blockhead is functionally mind-like.

mirage
February 2, 2005, 11:13 PM
Yes, nice post.

I think it is fairly clear that the computational mechanisms are interchangeable unless you want to invoke some direct physical existence for consciousness or "qualia" as the duellists do.

If the mind is simply the computational activity of the brain, then in principle with sufficient time and knowledge, all the molecular interaction of the brain could be worked through with a pencil and paper. Whatever "semantic" representation going on in the brain would still be going on at some impossibly complicated level in these calculations, however slowly, and however unsemantic the basic process appears.

All these examples show IMHO is if you substitute a very very inefficient mechanism to do the work of a very efficient massively parallel biocomputer, the inner workings look pretty silly and pretty unlike they could "think". This impression is entirely understandable because of course no such set up has a hope in hell of passing a Turing test in practice. However, this does not amount to a strong in principle objection to strong AI.

The only possible objection is if duellist qualia have any physical presence. Since simply identifying subjective experience of consciousness with a physical substance does absolutely nothing to resolve the first person/third person perspective issue, I can see no reason to grant this view any credence. (It's also evolutionarily implausible).

Jneale
February 3, 2005, 08:35 AM
Thanks for your comments.
I am presenting this in the form of a paper at a society at my school, that is normally attended by only the teachers and oxbridge candidates. I am only 16 but My philosophy teacher has allowed me to try my hand at presenting a paper. My two questions are this, firstly would you believe that this could have been written by someone older, i dont wanna sound like a complete amateur. Secondly i would very much appreciate any suggestions to improve my style etc.
thanks,
James

PoodleLovinPessimist
February 3, 2005, 10:15 AM
Secondly i would very much appreciate any suggestions to improve my style etc.

The content is pretty good. The style and formatting need a little work. Clean it up a bit and you've got a top-notch paper, at least at a college freshman level.

Obviously, clean up the grammar, spelling, and punctuation. Even the Microsoft Word style and grammar checking would be a help.

Use a blank line between paragraphs, not just sections. A paragraph should express one idea in a few sentences of detail.

Jneale
February 3, 2005, 11:59 AM
The second is to conclude that there is no such thing as semantics; "semantics" is just a name for a sufficiently complicated syntax.


In Searle's book 'speech acts' he puts forward this question,
'How does it happen that when people say, "Jones went home" they almost always mean Jones went home and not say Brown went to the party.' You suggest that we could draw a conclusion that denies semantics, if we were to do so i would be interested how one would go about answering this question.

p.s. the formatting is poor because i copy pasted from word :p

Huon
February 3, 2005, 01:02 PM
What I could add, if it were relevant :

Modern computers (machines) are a little more sophisticated than a Turing machine :
a - multi-programming, they can work many independent programs simultaneously ;
b - interactive, the operating system (Windows, Mac OS, Linux), offers the user a possibility of starting a program ; then the program runs, and offers the user a possibility of answering a question, and so on ...

Another remark : the dialog between the machine and James is "standard" and "programmed". And how could a machine say suddenly :

Machine : Ah, you are James, indeed ? I know a James, same name as you... Are you James who lived in Kingsbury, and was at school in 1994 with So-and-So, etc...

A person would not say that to every James indistinctly, and I do not see how such a situation could be programmed with only a few branches :

If ... (conditions) Then (actions 1) Else (actions 2) EndIf
While ... (conditions) Do (actions) EndDo
Do (actions) Until ... (conditions) EndDo

The problem is in (conditions) ! Semantics (Not all James are "this James").

Good luck !

PoodleLovinPessimist
February 3, 2005, 04:22 PM
In Searle's book 'speech acts' he puts forward this question,
'How does it happen that when people say, "Jones went home" they almost always mean Jones went home and not say Brown went to the party.' You suggest that we could draw a conclusion that denies semantics, if we were to do so i would be interested how one would go about answering this question.

Let me rephrase. I'm not denying that there is something that we call semantics. I'm just denying that there's anything qualitatively different between "semantics" and "very complicated syntax". There's nothing magical about semantics.

p.s. the formatting is poor because i copy pasted from word :p

Ok.

PoodleLovinPessimist
February 3, 2005, 04:23 PM
Modern computers (machines) are a little more sophisticated than a Turing machine :

This is not the case. Modern computers re just more efficient at implementing the TM programs we tend to prefer. But no computer can do anything that the simplest Turing Machine can't do.

mirage
February 3, 2005, 06:54 PM
This is not the case. Modern computers re just more efficient at implementing the TM programs we tend to prefer. But no computer can do anything that the simplest Turing Machine can't do.
Mine can play DVDs. A simple Turing Machine can't do that you moron! I thought you understood about 'puters. Another role model down the drain.

Yes, impressive stuff Jneal, for such a spring chicken. You are obviously a geek of the highest order. :thumbs:

P.S. I don't trust Searle on semantics (or AI for that matter). He thinks that "John promised to do X" gets over the famous is/ought divide. I.e. A statement of cold fact about John's actions implies a moral imperative regardless of any value system you might hold.

PoodleLovinPessimist
February 3, 2005, 08:58 PM
Mine can play DVDs. A simple Turing Machine can't do that you moron! I thought you understood about 'puters. Another role model down the drain.

Your computer can't play DVDs. Your DVD drive reads the disk, your speakers reproduce sounds and your monitor produces images. Your computer, OTOH, only converts the compressed data into another format; it could be replaced by any Turing Machine.

Call a me a moron. Harrumph.

James T
February 4, 2005, 12:30 AM
Mine can play DVDs. A simple Turing Machine can't do that you moron! I thought you understood about 'puters. Another role model down the drain.Shame you didn't look around first.

It's neither trivial nor apparently provable (for or against) the Church-Turing Thesis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church-Turing_thesis) proposes ...The thesis, in Turing's own words, can be stated as:

Every 'function which would naturally be regarded as computable' can be computed by a Turing machine. This statement is meant to be broadly applied, I'm even inclined toward including thought in this definition.

James T
February 4, 2005, 03:58 AM
I decided I should make the effort and read what you wrote :). Sorry for being so slack before. Continuous blocks of text have that effect on me. It would also be worth adding some section headings. This also helps remind you of what you are doing in each section and where your story is going.

Nice choice of introduction with Descartes. I've wondered what the implications of this would be if the demon actually changed your brain into a computer and your mind into a program. Surely you would still think cogito ergo sum. However, the demon might then play with what you thought you knew in disturbing ways. The duallism / monism issue seems a distraction at this point.

I was struck by the three premises in the middle. I found it difficult to work out a structure to your response on these three points, it looks like you just addressed the third, although where you say syntax is not sufficient for semantics, this part of the argument I believe to be sound you appear to be supporting the first premise. Personally, I think this one is also wrong. I'll describe why.

A computer programming language itself is purely syntactic, accepted. This is also true, although with greater complexity, of english and chinese. I've wondered if Wittgenstein's private language argument gives us the opening to say that thought can be completely expressed in language. If so then rather than demonstrating that AI was impossible we would instead be showing it as necessarily possible.

Jneale
February 4, 2005, 04:15 AM
thanks James T, i also decided the dualism thing was a bit of a distraction and have edited this in the next draft.

The reason i only deal with the third premise, 3.Syntax by itself is neither the same as or sufficient for semantic content, is because, my original interest was with the chinese room. It is the truth value of this third premise that the CRA is trying to affirm.

BillyTheKat
February 4, 2005, 05:13 AM
A minor point and a couple of more serious ones. The first is the kind of thing that markers pick up on; behaviorism is spelt without a "u". Secondly, if you're refering to a definition of behaviorism, it's always a good idea to outline what that definition is. Finally, bearing in mind that behaviorism says that a (a) we cannot test mind/mental activity; (b) we can only infer it from our actions, and (c) theories of mind/mental activity are unnecessary to explanations of human behaviouranyway, your subsequent comments actually imply a refutation of the premises of behaviorism; I think you'd need to make explicit what's led you to that conclusion and how you think you would do that.

Hope these suggestions help!

Jneale
February 4, 2005, 07:30 AM
Thanks Billythekat (classic alias),
I wasnt initially intending on refuting behaviorism (no "u" :D) merely interpreting it in a different way, although im not sure i made this explicit in my essay. Will add this to the final draft, thanks alot :)

Huon
February 4, 2005, 08:23 AM
Let me rephrase. I'm not denying that there is something that we call semantics. I'm just denying that there's anything qualitatively different between "semantics" and "very complicated syntax". There's nothing magical about semantics.

I agree. But usually, nobody uses a "very complicated syntax" in ordinary speech, and everybody "hopes" that he (or she) will be correctly understood. And it does not happen always, we can read this on many threads here !

mirage
February 4, 2005, 08:34 AM
Your computer can't play DVDs. Your DVD drive reads the disk, your speakers reproduce sounds and your monitor produces images. Your computer, OTOH, only converts the compressed data into another format; it could be replaced by any Turing Machine.

Call a me a moron. Harrumph.
;) I knew it was a mistake to use deliberate misunderstanding in plain text. I don't think you're a moron, far from it. (You may now rebuild your doubtless shattered sense of self esteem, safe in the knowledge that mirage supports it! (that was sarcasm too, btw))

PoodleLovinPessimist
February 4, 2005, 10:10 AM
(You may now rebuild your doubtless shattered sense of self esteem, safe in the knowledge that mirage supports it! (that was sarcasm too, btw))

:crying: Oh my fragile little feelings! Boo hoo!

PoodleLovinPessimist
February 4, 2005, 10:46 AM
I agree. But usually, nobody uses a "very complicated syntax" in ordinary speech, and everybody "hopes" that he (or she) will be correctly understood. And it does not happen always, we can read this on many threads here !

Searle is using "syntax" in a specific, formal way. One of my objections to Searle, though, is that he invites us to equivocate our informal, intuitive notions with his more formal notions.

In this case, he's using "syntax" to mean all formal, mechanical rules for creating statements. This is a different notion than our intuitive ideas about syntax: syntax is the content-nonspecific formal, mechanical rules we use to create statements, i.e. general grammar. Well of course if we exclude content-specific aspects of statements a priori, then there is an obvious difference between "syntax" and "semantics". But Searle invokes his equivocation and fallaciously reasons from the content-specific/content-nonspecific dichotomy to the mechanical/magical dichotomy.

He gets away with this equivocation because the formalisms that are grammar are directly available to our conscious mind: To some extent, how we format our statements grammatically is either directly conscious, or is readily "seen" by the conscious mind. However, whatever is happening in our brains that deals with meaning, i.e. semantics, is almost completely opaque. When we hear the word "chicken", we're not really conscious about how we relate that symbol to the rest of our thoughts.

But just because the content-nonspecific formatting and whatever it is that "semantic processing" have different levels of availability does not justify excluding mechanism or functionalism a priori.

Searles argument is this:

P1: The Chinese Room is non-conscious
P2: The Chinese Room passes the Turing Test
-----
C: A non-conscious process can pass the Turing Test

Now the Turing Test is an explicit definition of consciousness from empirical adequacy: The appearance of consciousness is consciousness. This is a definition, not an implication. So the Chinese Room argument is really arguing against empirical adequacy: Empirical adequacy can fool us into thinking some non-conscious process is indeed conscious.

So of course we have to examine the premises, specifically premise 1. Why should we accept the non-consciousness of the Chinese room as a premise? Remember that the Turing argument contradicts Searle's argument and affirms the consciousness of the the Chinese Room:

P1: If something passes the Turing Test, it is conscious
P2: The Chinese Room passes the Turing Test
----
C: The Chinese Room is conscious

So why should we buy Searle's premises, that a non-conscious entity can pass the Turing Test? We have to examine Searle's argument to P1:

P1: A system that does not perform semantic operations is not conscious
P2: The Chinese Room performs only "syntatic" operations, not "semantic" operations
----
C: The Chinese Room is not conscious

This is a forceful argument; it's inherently plausible to believe that "semantic" operation is a requirement for consciousness. However, this is where the equivocation steps in. There are two definitional differentiators between "syntax" and "semantics": Syntax/semantics as content-nonspecific/content-specific, and syntax/semantics as mechanical/nonmechanical.

Searle invites us to invoke the equivocation because his definition of the operation of the Chinese Room does not ever reference the content of the Chinese symbols. No attempt is made to remember any specific symbols from one conversation to another; and the book that the operator is using contains only grammatical rules; it does not contain relationships like "symbol-for-chicken" related to "symbol-for-bird" related to "symbol-for-kind-of". This is a semantic relationship, not a syntactic (grammatical) relationship.

But it's obvious that as specified, using only content nonspecific grammar, Searle's Chinese Room will trivially fail the Turing Test. All I have to do to defeat it is refer to the last conversation I had.

In order to get the Chinese Room to actually pass the Turing Test, we must add non-grammatical symbolic relationships; these content-specific relationships have to be both robust (relating chicken to bird, chicken to food, chicken to cowardice, chicken to attractive young woman, etc.) and dynamic; The program must relate the content of the conversation in both directions, to reference pre-existing knowledge, and be an object of reference for future statements.

So we must add at least a mechanical content-specific process to the Chinese Room to get it to pass the Turing Test. But now Searle's original setup has been blown: Even if we say that the inside of the Chinese Room is only doing "syntax" in the sense of mechanical operations, we can no longer say that the inside of the Chinese Room is doing only "syntax" in the sense of content-nonspecific grammar.

Thus, in order to render the Chinese Room non-conscious a priori (prior to passing the Turing Test), we must explicitly define "semantic" processing not merely as content-specific but also directly non-mechanical. And, of course, if we assume that consciousness is non-mechanical, we will vacuously conclude that consciousness is non-mechanical. The Chinese Room argument is exposed as vacuously circular.

PoodleLovinPessimist
February 4, 2005, 10:49 AM
When I say that "semantics" is nothing more than "very complicated syntax", I am explicitly referencing the mechanizability definition of syntax, not, of course, the content-nonspecific definition of syntax.

mirage
February 4, 2005, 11:22 AM
Thus, in order to render the Chinese Room non-conscious a priori (prior to passing the Turing Test), we must explicitly define "semantic" processing not merely as content-specific but also directly non-mechanical. And, of course, if we assume that consciousness is non-mechanical, we will vacuously conclude that consciousness is non-mechanical. The Chinese Room argument is exposed as vacuously circular.
Right on Commander! :thumbs:

Jneale
February 4, 2005, 01:07 PM
hmm, i hope my teacher does not say what PoodleLovinPessimist just said because i would be too awestruck to answer lol.

exile
February 8, 2005, 06:22 AM
A minor point and a couple of more serious ones. The first is the kind of thing that markers pick up on; behaviorism is spelt without a "u". Secondly, if you're refering to a definition of behaviorism, it's always a good idea to outline what that definition is. Finally, bearing in mind that behaviorism says that a (a) we cannot test mind/mental activity; (b) we can only infer it from our actions, and (c) theories of mind/mental activity are unnecessary to explanations of human behaviouranyway, your subsequent comments actually imply a refutation of the premises of behaviorism; I think you'd need to make explicit what's led you to that conclusion and how you think you would do that.

Hope these suggestions help!

Behaviorism (US) = Behaviourism (UK).

vsopvs
February 13, 2005, 02:14 PM
First, i guess, i need to make it known that i am not a professional, neither in philosophy nor in AI, so my apologies if what i say sounds trivial and/or plain stupid.

Still, i would like to share what i think about CRA & Turing Test.

The way Turing defined his test suggests a number of things about his understanding of intelligence:

- to decide, whether an entity is intelligent, you need another entity, evaluator, which is intelligent by definition, upfront (that is, it considers itself intelligent :)). This effectively means that we "admit" intelligence in others, based on our evaluation of them. This is our free will, we decide freely whether an entity is or is not intelligent. This is exactly what happens in life, when we deal with other people. Determining intelligence in other person is a never ending process. Biological adaptation, in fact ...

- intelligence is a continuum; there's no border, rather it's "more intelligent", "less intelligent" and so on. Where mere reflection ends and "understanding" starts - nobody would be able to determine. Surely if we admit some intelligence in certain animals, Little Green Men might (or might not) admit some intelligence in us ... So we can potentially fail Turing Test (being behind the wall :))

- intelligence is subjective: if an evaluator in Turing test is a 5 year-old child, her evaluation would be based on here own intelligence. This was meant by Turing, and no IQ test, obviously, would be endorsed by him as meaningful within this framework.

This said, let's return to CRA. A couple of people in this thread already mentioned one piece conspicuously missing from canonical CRA. This is memory, ability to take previous conversation into account. Once you add memory to CR, the whole thing immediately becomes active. And this is a key.

Memory of the whole conversation (lifetime long), which can be accessed on an associative basis, is a key element here, because it immediately implies an ability to learn, which is a required component for any evaluator to admit intelligence in "the other".

The main question, posed by Searle in CRM, is "where the understanding resides". Surely this question is completely irrelevant. CRM, if it operates correctly, i.e. fools the observer into thinking it intelligent, becomes an intelligent entity (for this observer). Intelligence is a property. To ask where the intelligence (or understanding) resides, is the same as to ask where the weight of a body resides.

Another thing i keep thinking about is that intelligence is another name for consiousness, or awareness in Schroedinger sense. May be we can consider unconscious intelligence, something along Google lines ... but this is definitely not related to Turing's thoughts ...

To clarify my own position re AI, i am with Strong AI, with the only difference that once strong AI is there, it becomes useless in the same sense as one human is useless to another, meaning a human can not (and should not) be used ...

As to whether this AI would be based on purely mechanical computing devices (in Church-Turing sense), i have no opinion on that ... but my "gut feeling" is - yes, purely mechanical. Which does not mean that consciousness is purely mechanical, whatever it is built from ...